Mike Ditka has lost at least 10 games in all three of his seasons in New Orleans.

To all appearances, today's NFL had passed both these second-generation coaches by. And I wasn't the only one who thought so.

Vermeil coached some nice Philadelphia Eagles teams around the cusp of the 1980s -- he even reached Super Bowl XV -- but his return to coaching had been a disaster. Vermeil's St. Louis Rams were 5-11 in 1997 and 4-12 last year.

Like Vermeil, Ditka was a terrific coach from a bygone era. His record in 11 seasons with the Chicago Bears was a muscular 106-62. Ditka's Bears actually won a Super Bowl, whipping the Patriots in 1986 with a team considered among the greatest of all-time. Still, Ditka's return in New Orleans produced disappointing back-to-back records of 6-10.

Well, 12 games into the 1999 season, the two men have followed increasingly divergent paths. They meet, appropriately, Sunday in New Orleans when the Rams visit the Saints.

Vermeil, 63, is the toast of St. Louis, where his Rams locked up the NFC West with a 34-21 victory over Carolina last Sunday. With four regular-season games left to play in a division populated by the 49ers and Falcons, St. Louis is 10-2 and has a five-game lead.

"It's an unbelievable feeling," Vermeil said, through his customary veil of tears. "I thought that with the right kind of people around me, I could do it again. I don't like to use the word, 'I.' But I thought we could do it again. Winning is not complicated. If you surround yourself with the right people that don't complicate it, you're going to end up winning."

In New Orleans, the news is not as encouraging. On the same day Vermeil won his 10th game for the first time since 1981, Ditka's Saints lost their 10th game for the third straight season. The Atlanta Falcons, hardly at the height of their Super Bowl powers, dusted New Orleans 35-12.

	“	It's foolish of me to sit here and say we're going in the right direction. We've got 10 losses. We're certainly not going in the right direction. We're just not sure of ourselves. ”
		— Saints coach Mike Ditka

"There's not much I can say," Ditka said. "I'd like to have better answers for you, but I don't have many right now. If I get them, I'll give them to you."

Ditka, who turned 60 earlier this season, is under contract to coach two more seasons, through 2002. He has been getting a lot of retirement questions the last few weeks.

"I understand what you're saying," Ditka said Sunday, responding to a reporter's question. "But I told you I'm not going to quit. I'm going to stick it out as long as I can. I don't have a problem with that. Lots of other people probably have a problem with that, but I don't."

The long-range future of Ditka and the Saints looks fairly bleak. Ditka, who is technically only the head coach, convinced the team's braintrust to trade the entire draft for the right to draft Heisman Trophy winner Ricky Williams. When he has been healthy, Williams has been impressive, but an ankle injury and a recent bout of turf toe have often kept him out of the lineup.

A whole handful of Billy Joes at quarterback isn't going to win without an offensive line and a defense. Only the defenseless 49ers and Redskins have allowed more points in the NFC than the Saints' 304.

On Monday, Ditka still sounded dazed and confused.

"Right now, anything I say to you is just words," he said. "It's like that commercial, 'Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah -- that's all it is, just words. If I say anything ... I just don't know right now.

"It's foolish of me to sit here and say we're going in the right direction. We've got 10 losses. We're certainly not going in the right direction. We're just not sure of ourselves."

The contrast in St. Louis, where Vermeil won his first division title since 1980, is startling. For the first time in 28 years of football in St. Louis, played by both the Cardinals (who left in 1988) and the Rams (who arrived in 1995), the city with the arch will have a home playoff game. Regardless of the results in the final four regular-season games, the TWA Dome will host a postseason game the second or third weekend of January.

"It's not Dick Vermeil magic or anything," Vermeil said. "There's a deep philosophy and a deep belief. It's worked for me before, and I don't see any reason to change. And this group of kids -- my wife Carol says this, and she's fed them all, so she knows -- she says this is as fine a group as we've ever had. They're great young men in there. And they're willing to make a commitment."

Give the perpetually optimistic Vermeil credit for not losing his players after two dreadful seasons. He also deserves kudos for nurturing Kurt Warner (32 touchdowns, nine interceptions), trading for Marshall Faulk (192 carries, 1.026 yards) and showcasing Isaac Bruce (67 catches for 979 yards and 11 touchdowns).

There are still questions, of course. It is worth noting that the Rams' only two losses came to the only teams on the schedule with winning records, Tennessee and Detroit. But those games were on the road. For a game at least, St. Louis will be playing where its heart is.

"We have to be very pleased," Vermeil said. "But being pleased doesn't mean that we are satisfied. We have never allowed the big picture to go out of sight. We did what we had to do first, and that was win the division. What we have to do next is find a way to win home-field advantage.

"We have a lot of work left to do."

Greg Garber is a regular contributor to ESPN.com.